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Wing Lam Kung Fu Online Teaching

Post questions about Wing Lam Kung Fu School here.

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Would you subscribe to this?

Yes
31
89%
No
4
11%
 
Total votes : 35

Wing Lam Kung Fu Online Teaching

Postby wleforum on Wed Feb 23, 2005 3:41 pm

Talked to sifu the other day and he is interested in live stream webcam from our kwoon. It will be our regular kwoon classes being broadcasting live. It will be for anyone from anywhere to learn the same thing that our regular students learn from sifu lam. Miss a class! No problem because you can download from the archives of classes that you missed.

The cost probably is the same or less as current tuition at the kwoon.

We just want to know what your feedbacks are for this idea. This is something not really new, there may be some other schools have already done this.
Last edited by wleforum on Sun May 22, 2005 9:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Streaming Class

Postby Chuck on Mon Apr 04, 2005 4:26 am

Its a idea to thing about. I must say that it would cost more from the ISP to handle people downloading it from the internet once your video collect gets very big, since there is a bandwidth cost per month. Also what about them spreading it all over p2p for free?

I would like to see WLE teaching at companies or fitness clubs. Make some deals with the school districts on discounts packages. I think taichi for some big business on thier lunch break would be nice. If my company offered taichi at lunch, man I would be able to do that everyday, because I have no time after work.

Promote healthly living through kungfu training. I have ton of ideas :)
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Postby Tom on Wed Apr 20, 2005 2:48 am

Hello there,

iI think it is a good idea. I live in Germany and I used to live in Munich where there was quite a good Gung Fu school teaching Hung style. Now, living in the western part of Germany I can only go to the Netherlands to a very small, but good school . Neverftheless it is a bit far.

So I already bought a bunch of the WL-tapes about Hung Gar to be able to advance without goint to the Netherlands all the time and that works quite well. If I could watch classes online I would be able to learn even more.

Yet , I think prices should be less than your usual monthly fee, because you cannot really participate. And of course the video quality should be good, at least better than the usual webcam stuff. I don't mind downloading videos because I pay flat and need not worry about volume.

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Postby Salamander Feng at Home on Sat Apr 23, 2005 4:55 am

Not being an internet expert, I don't know if I would actually be able to see video quality streamed from the internet to my home. The idea certainly sounds interesting, though I don't know how much time I have to watch given other commitments.

Also, when I look at tapes I can do so in a large open area of my home where I can mimic the movements. For streaming video, I would have to be sitting in front of the computer which is a smaller area such that I cannot work out.

Would you consider putting the lessons on CD, which is lighter weight than video tape, and mailing out a two or three month set? I understand there is an increased risk of pirating with CD's, hope you can figure out how to overcome that, but since these are lessons rather than full form instruction the lack of a rewind should not be a problem and the much cheaper shipping should make this a more attractive option to WLE.
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Postby PaulS on Sun Apr 24, 2005 3:40 pm

Alterantive idea would be to fund some web space where subscribers could post video footage of themselves and then receive correction on their footage.

This could be done with a couple of key features:-

a) Ability for subscribers to UPLOAD training clips to a hosted web-site from where they would receive a "play by play" commentary - maybe even using the yellow pens and stuff that they use on ESPN to highlight where you are going wrong..... :shock: . They could then download the assessment footage with errors highlighted.

b) Item (a) would be accompanied with a forum where the poster of the footage could ask specific questions to the assessor and receive appropriate instruction. Perhaps even being able to view clips of the instructor doing the same sections as have been critiqued in (a) above

c) Possible facility to group people of same level and, with consent, do a "masterclass" on a form for groups of people of the same level. Using teaching points from (a) and (b) above to correct and improve multiple students at same time.

d) people could upload/download application pictures or footage for discussion.

This could work either as a CD or download. However, Download would be better as the forum section would rely upon having access to the forum and ability to upload/download clips.

The question of piracy might be addressed somehwat by the fact that the corrections would be related to parts of the forms etc rather than posting a full instructional section on a whole form.

Just a thought - may be totally impractical.....

However, I would pay for the above!!

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Re: Streaming Class

Postby sparkythex on Thu May 26, 2005 9:46 pm

I like this idea.
I am on dial up so to download stuff that is very big takes me hours & so I don’t think this is very practical for me.

i agree.
It will also be a extra fee for wle as it would take a lot more bandwidth

Also takes a lot of disk space,
you could reduce that buy only limiting to archive to only 2 months or so back

Chuck wrote:what about them spreading it all over p2p for free?

there are ways to stream & not have your stuff stolen.

I may have to research this (but I am pretty sure)
.wma is one of the formats.
If you were to open the file it is really nothing more then a link to the server.
So if .wma file is downloaded when opened starts to pull from server but doesn’t download.
(in laymen’s terms) It is like playing the file over the network from the host.

Also there are software programs that will connect to servers but don’t download.
Winamp is one of them.
Of course Winamp, I don’t think that supports usernames & passwords.
Neither does windows media player.

But if other sites have streaming video classes & they have not had stuff stolen.
I think that if you did it correct wle would not have any problem with lessons being given out for free
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Counsel others not to use force to conquer the universe.
Force only brings resistance & is followed by loss .

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Yes Vote Here

Postby Jack Time on Wed Oct 26, 2005 6:39 pm

Yes, I would be very interested in online classes. Count me in if you decide to do this.
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Postby Salamander Feng at Home on Fri Dec 02, 2005 4:26 am

I still think I would prefer you to tape the instructional portion of each class, put maybe ten of those on disk, and mail out the disk in an ordinary cheap envelope, as this streaming business involves a lot of "e" and means I have to sit at a computer station. Price would be for a year's subscription. I think you should ask tis as a poll question -- streaming video or disks mailed bulk rate.

You could then, later, sell these disk sets (only it would be more than ten lessons per disk) as part of your regular merchandise!

In any event, why don't you try taping 1 lesson now, posting it here for free, and letting the potential customers see it. Have a poll question beyond it which would be "How much are you willing to pay for a year's subscription to this product?" and then put down prices in a range (e.g., cost of mailing (varies based on area) plus $300, $375, $400, $475, etc., up to the price of in-class instruction). This should give you an accurate idea of the potential market and optimal rate. If this works like TV, the real income could be from the residuals market (the regular merchandise comment above).

LEGAL ISSUES: You would need to have each student at the lesson sign a release (the sign-in sheet should repeat the release, but you want one on file for every student), and you would want to start including that in your contracts -- all of them -- from this point forward in case you later plan on such a project. Release should include at least consent to dissemination, agreement that there is no compensation for use of their likeness on original and repeats. Talk to your lawyer, not my area of the law. If this is real-time, there is a problem. What if some student gets hurt, or verbally abused, or cries, or one student does something inappropriate and embarassing to another student? What if a student looks at the camera and makes a racial remark or speech? These are not actors; giving them a real-time forum has its own risks. Some students may have privacy or timidity reasons to not want to be taped. At least if this is delayed dissemination, you can edit things out. Students should be notified to tell you before they leave class for the day if they have a problem with something they did being disseminated; and your agreement to provide video lessons should indicate there may be editing of lessons as deemed appropriate by WLKF in its sole discretion or requested to protect the privacy of students.


I would be a little worried at how few people have responded to this poll. I suggest you have each subscription be for a calendar year ending December 31 rather than starting when they sign up. Pro-rate the cost or provide earlier lessons so they get a full year. That way if the cost of taping exceeds the revenue, you can cancel the project at a fixed date without dealing with contractual obligations.

S. Feng 8)
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Postby Guan Yu on Fri Dec 02, 2005 6:16 pm

Good idea in theory, but I don't think it will work out in practicality.
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Postby MHH on Tue Dec 06, 2005 1:46 pm

While I would really like to learn a couple of sets I don't have (e.g., the Iron Wire set), I don't think this is the best idea. Aside from pirating issues, I wonder how the student will know that he is doing everything properly. What about questions the student might have? Will all of the applications be shown for each movement? I know that Sifu Wing lam has a lot of valuble information and that a lot of people would like to learn what he has to offer. There just seem to be things that can't be taught over the internet, but that is only my opinion. I don't mean to offend anyone who considers this a good idea.
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Postby The-higher-truth on Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:47 pm

I would most definately subscibe to online lesson. I'm too far away to take actual lessons, and my schedule is always a bit hectic. Right now I'm learning drunken boxing, Jeet Kune Do, White Crane Kung Fu, and Hup Kido. I found out about Sifu Lam and just had to learn from him, but thanks to lack of funds to get to California, I'm just learning my current styles. This would be a welcome addition to my current lessons.
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Postby blakelyneal on Sat Jan 28, 2006 1:09 pm

Salamander Feng at Home wrote:I still think I would prefer you to tape the instructional portion of each class, put maybe ten of those on disk, and mail out the disk in an ordinary cheap envelope, as this streaming business involves a lot of "e" and means I have to sit at a computer station. Price would be for a year's subscription. I think you should ask tis as a poll question -- streaming video or disks mailed bulk rate.

You could then, later, sell these disk sets (only it would be more than ten lessons per disk) as part of your regular merchandise!

In any event, why don't you try taping 1 lesson now, posting it here for free, and letting the potential customers see it. Have a poll question beyond it which would be "How much are you willing to pay for a year's subscription to this product?" and then put down prices in a range (e.g., cost of mailing (varies based on area) plus $300, $375, $400, $475, etc., up to the price of in-class instruction). This should give you an accurate idea of the potential market and optimal rate. If this works like TV, the real income could be from the residuals market (the regular merchandise comment above).

LEGAL ISSUES: You would need to have each student at the lesson sign a release (the sign-in sheet should repeat the release, but you want one on file for every student), and you would want to start including that in your contracts -- all of them -- from this point forward in case you later plan on such a project. Release should include at least consent to dissemination, agreement that there is no compensation for use of their likeness on original and repeats. Talk to your lawyer, not my area of the law. If this is real-time, there is a problem. What if some student gets hurt, or verbally abused, or cries, or one student does something inappropriate and embarassing to another student? What if a student looks at the camera and makes a racial remark or speech? These are not actors; giving them a real-time forum has its own risks. Some students may have privacy or timidity reasons to not want to be taped. At least if this is delayed dissemination, you can edit things out. Students should be notified to tell you before they leave class for the day if they have a problem with something they did being disseminated; and your agreement to provide video lessons should indicate there may be editing of lessons as deemed appropriate by WLKF in its sole discretion or requested to protect the privacy of students.


I would be a little worried at how few people have responded to this poll. I suggest you have each subscription be for a calendar year ending December 31 rather than starting when they sign up. Pro-rate the cost or provide earlier lessons so they get a full year. That way if the cost of taping exceeds the revenue, you can cancel the project at a fixed date without dealing with contractual obligations.

S. Feng 8)


very nice post feng I cant agree with you more :D

the P2P thing isnt a very smart idea for Sifu Lam because there wouldnt be any bring back money wise :D
hey... can we keep this thing civil? if not I'm gonna to need to break some legs...
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Postby Mjolnir on Fri May 05, 2006 10:48 am

I too would love to see it happen. I live far away as well and have money problems when I try to plan relocations. I would not mind paying. Please keep us informed!

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Postby DRShoalin on Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:26 am

I was wondering if your online web streaming classes ever happen? I would be interest in this type of training.
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Postby ogrelee on Mon Jun 04, 2007 10:20 pm

I consider WLE's distance learning to be the best out there, bar none. So count me in if you do this. I'll learn just for learning's sake.
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